we dont want to discuss it all day long. What he said was said arrogantly and was wrong. What I said was correct. Maybe you need to "get" some knowledge also...

his condensending attitude and arrogance was the reason for the anger and rude comments made in return. It doesnt take a rock scientist to figure that out either....maybe theres a rock school in your area...good luck to ya.

 

Mach 1, I do agree with you that nitrous has a cooling affect on the temperature in the cylinders. However, I was under the impression that the nitrous oxide mixture would oxidize...the oxygen splitting from the nitrogen atoms. The boost of power would then have to come from the increased pressure due to there being more oxygen in the mixture, like a turbocharger effect...is this line of thinking wrong? It's what I was told about nitrous oxide.

 

Higher percentage of oxygen, but the same pressure.

 

I didnt make the comment that cylinder pressure would not increase, b_real45 did. Read the post more carefully, and address your question to him.

 

What I have said is also true.. nitrous does not increase compression like the way turbo/blower does. Nitrous can add an increase in pressure in the combustion chamber.. but not like how turbos and blowers do it. This is totally different. You'll be safer running NOS on a high compression engine than you would running a turbo... not to say that it can't be done, but with nitrous, you're not increasing static compression which is a big factor with detonation.

 

Why not? I thought the cooling affect prevented detonation caused by the increased pressure. You still havent explained why nitrous does not affect cylinder pressure?

 

Yes, the cooling affect does help prevent detonation.. I never said anything close to the opposite. But, it doesn't increase pressures the way a turbo does it. Nitrous is just excited gas that is shot into the chamber to cool off the combustion process. It is constantly being burned up so there isn't a constant excess of air in the chamber causing increases in pressure. It provides more oxygen (not just regular air) so combustion is more effecient. Turbos and blowers constantly force air into the chamber (of course when in boost) which increases the compression ratio... which causes lots of heat. It's the combination of increased pressure and heat buildup from turbos that can instigate detonation.

People that use too big of shot of nitrous blow up not because they have high compression engines.. it's because there's too much oxygen for a complete and effecient combustion ... so you have excess which disrupts the timing of the combustion process.. which in turn causes detonation.

Also remember, it's not the actual air coming in that pushes the pistons up and down.. it's the combustion process that does it.

Air+fuel+spark = combustion
more air (turbo) + fuel + spark = bigger combustion
denser air (nitrous) + fuel + spark = bigger combustion

 

Obviously. Its not a turbo, its nitrous. It forces more oxygen into the cylinder , it just injects it in a liquid form wich is then turned into a gaseous form. So why doent this increase pressure?

That doesnt even make sense. Are you saying a turbochargers excess air remains in the chamber and isnt burned, thus increasing pressure? Cylinder pressure, not manifold pressure.
Maybe you can explain that one again, because it sounds like your talking a bunch of crap to me...

Thats why I said nitrous can be used in high compression applications, because of the cooling affect, thus preventing detonation. Nitrous , turbo, or supercharger are ALL forcing more Oxygen into the cylinder, they just do it in a different way. If more air in the chamber increases compression ratio, why doesnt more air which started its journey from a bottle of nitrous increase it?

If you are saying that the nitrous wont increase it as much as a turbo because you are getting pure oxygen and not everything else thats in the air, I guess that would make sense to a point..but wouldnt it increase some?


You forgot something: Compression. Without it, you dont have combustion.

 

Omg... are you trying to nit pick at everything???

No **** there needs to be compression for a combustion... we're talking about our motors here right??? or did someone throw in some other sort of "engine" that doesn't use compression to work???

No, turbo and nitrous don't force oxygen into the chamber the same way! Nitrous has a large amount of acuatl OXYGEN. Turbo forces the air around you which is mostly nitrogen and a little of oxygen. Turbo does not add pure oxygen into the chamber.

Nitrous is injected first as a liquid form??? Then it turns into a gas??? WTF?? care to explain?

Please... you tell US what your reasoning is on how Nitrous increases compressions.

You too might need to go and read some material.

 

The nitrous in the bottle is a liquid. When it hits the hot manifold, it expands, cooling and turning into a gas at around the same time. Thats what was explained to me by a knowledgeable nitrous user, and it makes sense.

Im not nitpicking anything, just responding to your comments. Whats wrong? You seem to be getting a little excited....


"No, turbo and nitrous don't force oxygen into the chamber the same way!"

Did I say that? Hmmmmmmmmm...I dont think so. Maybe you can point out where I said that.

I already explained why I thought nitrous would increase compression, maybe you cant comprehend english?

You said yourself that "force air into the chamber (of course when in boost) which increases the compression ratio... "

So why wont more oxygen in the chamber increase the compression ratio? Your saying air will increase it, but oxygen wont.
We all want to know........

Please educate us..........or do another cheap cop out like your last post.

 

You know I've been following this thread and it seems both of you are right in a way, so the arguing should just stop now...I can't even tell who is saying what anymore. Also, it's a little off topic now, too.

 

1.) Lets start off in a different way... What you said about it increases the pressure then cools it off preventing detonation.. yes thats true. We can all read Holley's website. It's there for all.

2.) YOU said that nitrous is INJECTED AS A LIQUID when in fact, as soon as it's out of the bottle, it is in a gaseous state. Never is it in liquid form when inside the engine.

3.) I stated in my first few posts that nitrous DOES increase cylinder pressures... but "not the way a turbo does". All I wanted to include was that a turbo/blower does it constantly (after boost threshold) but nitrous is not so. Plus it's a gradual thing with a turbo/blower but with nitrous, it's a --BAM-- quick change (in pressures).

4.) I'm not sure how all this started... but I do know that Nitrous does not force air to increase compression... what increases the compression from Nitrous is the actual act of Nitrous Oxide breaking down into nitrogen/oxygen... this expansion is what I'm claiming is different than how a turbo increases compression.

In short, nitrous, turbo, blowers all increase cylinder pressures, but turbo/blowers actually force the air in while the nitrous *creates* the air with a chemical reaction. (no it doesn't really create air... but the force of the chemical break down is what creates all the pressure).

EDIT: Btw, Mach 1... I'm not sure what I've said to you in previous posts.. but I do not appreciate the attitude you responded with. You may think I'm full of crap, but keep that to yourself until you get to know me.

 

you two are truly remarkable. you turned this guys thread into a discussion of nonsense and misinformation. congradulations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/

you guys should beat each other with shoes

 

I dont know anything about you other than what was written here, and it seems to me like you are full of crap. Sorry, I call it like I see it.